The longer the club the FLATTER the lie angle is needed. I look at the importance of having the correct lie angle on your irons. Launch angle is something most golfers associate with drivers or other woods/hybrids. Here are a couple of quick examples of how to read the PING color code chart. . Lie angles almost always range from the mid-50 degrees (in drivers) to the mid-60 degrees (in short irons). The standard lie angle of drivers and woods is in the range between 56 and 60 degrees, hybrid / rescue clubs between 58 and 62 degrees, irons between 61 and 64 degrees. Why do we not see much, if anything, about lie angle options for metal woods, hybrids and drivers. He said adjusting the lie angle on higher lofted clubs open the face too much. The shape of the grip, the texture, and the size all have to be considered. And when you consider that some golfers could be playing with clubs that are off by 2-3 degrees, finding clubs with a proper lie angle could make a huge difference in . Lie angle is, for most people, more important than club length. The Lie Angle of 79.5 degrees is a special number for a lot of broomstickers who want the putter to move . For those who have a . Does 1 or 2 degrees really make that much of a difference? Most irons have a 4 degree difference between each club from the 5 iron through the sand wedge and around 2 to 3 degrees for the longer irons, this typically equates to a 10 yard gap between each . The calculations here are based on 1/2 club length difference = 5 yards distance difference and every 4 loft angle difference = 5 yards distance difference. Long story short, there is no such thing as the right loft for all drivers. Bet You Didn't Know: Hockey Stick Lies: 4 - 137, 5 - 135, 5.5 - 134, 6 - 133, 7 - 131. Business seller information. But although we can say for sure that most golfers need more loft than they now use, the exact amount depends on several different . Loft and lie changes are more or less permanent. LOFT: $1.00ea club not needing adjustment; $2.00ea club that needs adjustment. Not on a driver. Here are a couple of quick examples of how to read the PING color code chart. Those of you that have been fitted, can you feel that change? Titleist Vokey SM8 Lob Wedge / 60 Degree / Wedge Flex Titleist SM8 Shaft. After a mile, you'll be off by 92.2 feet. Lie angle matters far less when loft gets lower, face angle then dictates start direction much more. A 5'10" golfer with a wrist-to-floor measurement of 34" would fall in the black dot section where they would be fit for standard lie angle and standard shaft lengths. The adjustment that most manufacturers have, but few talk about, is lie angle. The driver shown has 55 degrees lie angle, 12.5 (12) degrees of loft and the face angle here is purposely adjusted in the gauge to 0 degrees so the loft can be measured in the square face (hit) position. I would try adjusting the lie to 1, or even 2 degrees UP. Try to see a local fitter and hit some shots with the adjusted lie angle. I gave my mate a loan of my spare 49 degree Vokey wedge, he couldnt play it as it was too flat for him. For every degree your clubs are off in lie angle, it can cause your shots to travel four yards off your intended target line. If your lie angles are way off, it's going to be hard to hit the ball accurately. But then this will affect the open/closed position of the clubface at impact, along with the lie angle. As for irons, the difference in distance between 8-iron (37-39 degrees) and 9-iron (41-43 degrees) is usually 10-15 yards. There is no 1 standard for lie angles. Reply Report comment. Besides putters, drivers have the smallest loft angle of any club in your bag. For example, if a 5 iron has a standard lie angle of 62 degrees, but you either custom order it or have it adjusted to be a lie angle of 64 degrees, then it would be considered to be 2 degrees upright. There is no 1 standard for lie angles. Wedges and the 9-iron have the largest standard lie angle, at 64 degrees. If you're looking at the lie angle on each club in a set, Sieckmann noted that an elite player might be 1-degree upright in his irons but get gradually flatter when transitioning to the wedges,. Running the math, a lie adjustment of one degree on a 36 inch club yields a change in hand position of s = r = (36 inches) * (1 deg * (2 rad/360 deg)) = /5 inch = 0.628. inches. I understand that process but, I never get a lie like that on the course. A player who is 5'6" with a wrist-to-floor measurement of 32" would fall in the red dot . Instead of calling it a lie angle adjustment, most manufacturers talk about fade, neutral, or draw settings. Turns out I needed irons which were one degree upright. The 2-degree limit is only recommended when changing the lofts on irons due to the potential effect such bends will have on the sole angle of the club. 1. Every company has a different standard. Flat Lie Angle A flat lie angle is when the club's toe is on the ground, but the heel is lifted. Every company has a different standard. Club Size: Lob Wedge. Drivers have the lowest loft of all clubs, except putters. (Lie angles on putters reach into the 70s.) Testing shows that best performance comes when both the toe and heel sit evenly at impact. If you are not making square contact with the ground, it can throw off your clubface in relation to the target, which causes hooks and slices. correct lie. Every dot in Ping color code symbolizes a degree and the type of lie angle of the club. An angle of less then 56 degrees, therefore, has a flatter lie angle, while an angle of more than 56 degrees is classified as a more upright club. Simply put, having the correct lie angle can make you a more accurate golfer. We . Loft is the degree of the angle formed between a straight line from the ground and the club head, when the club head is sitting squarely on the ground. Here is my driver set at 12.5 degrees of loft You can bend a club more than 2 degrees. Our most popular Lie Angle is 79.5 degrees. For every 1/2 inch you add to a club, the lie angle is effected by 1/2*. The Ping colored dot lie angles range from 4 degrees flat to 5 degrees upright. A proper lie angle is important in improving your accuracy, and this is what Ping color code system seeks to address. Matching the lie angle of clubs to the specific golfer is one of the goals of a clubfitting session. In irons, the range is typically from 59 or 60 degrees to around 64 degrees. Lie angle too flat at impact. A 4* lie would create a hook machine. Aug 25, 2015 at 6:39 pm . Would you adjust lie angle on 54 and 58 degree wedges? We stop a half-degree short for safety, because who knows when you're going to run into a tournament official with a protractor. The single axis swing DOES NOT need more upright lie angles in clubs. Red color code (1 degree flat), 36 long and heavy. One of the most important, misunderstood and overlooked aspects of your golf clubs is the lie angle. The club will then be aiming left and the ball is more likely to go to the left. Most likely, it means that a club is 2 degrees more upright than the standard lie angle for that brand and model. A lie angle that is too flat will result in a mark at the toe, while a lie angle that's too upright will produce a mark more towards the heel of the club. Ever since a 2003 "Golf Digest" study said that most golfers needed more loft on their drivers, the quest for the "correct" loft has heated up. But it matters in putting, too. Drivers along with 2 and 3 irons have a little loft. It also makes sense that the 36-degree club in our example will cause the golf ball to rise into the air on a steeper angle and descend on a steeper angle than the 23-degree club. If your swing speed is above 90mph then a 9.5 - 11 degree loft will give you the best angle of attack. While this difference may seem miniscule, it does play a very big role in figuring out the correct lie for each golfer. My irons are 2 degrees flat (I am short at 5'7). It's always an acute angle, less than 90 degrees. At this point the focus is on finding the correct lie angle. Second, lie is fitted after shaft length has been selected because length affects dynamic lie angle - every 1/2" of length added makes the iron play 1 degree more upright; the reverse is true for reduced length. I know Sieckmann is an advocate of flattening the lie angle on wedges. Reply Report comment. Ping has a total of 12 dot colors and each one is different based on each golfer's necessary lie angle of their irons as well as the shaft length. (Image credit: Howard Boylan) If the sole does not come through to the ball flat to the ground but rather with the heel down more, this means that the club's lie angle is too upright for you. As you go up in loft then lie angle gets . Find a large selection and discount prices on putter shafts from leading golf shaft manufacturers. A properly fit lie angle gives the ball the best possible chance to strike the highest . A difference of only 2 degrees may not seem like a lot, it can make a world of difference out on the course. too upright. Golfers who swing faster than 120mph would require a loft below 9.5 degrees and those golfers with a slower swing below 90mph would be better choosing a loft between 11.5 . Lie angle too upright at impact. The Myths Myth #1 - Lie angle affects accuracy Myth #2 - Lie angle affects distance Myth #3 - Lie angle affects consistency Myth #4 - Using a lie board is a good way to fit lie angle How We Tested We gathered 7 golfers of varying handicaps for this test. An 8.5 driver has a loft of 8.5 degrees, while a 10.5 driver has a loft of 10.5 degrees. Thanks, Most drivers are 45 (or more) inches long and have lie angles of about 56 and up to 60 . See how this change affects ball flight. A 5'10" golfer with a wrist-to-floor measurement of 34" would fall in the black dot section where they would be fit for standard lie angle and standard shaft lengths. GOLFCLUBS4CASH LTD. Murray Winton. For wedges it is nearly always 63 or 64 degrees. So each color has a slightly higher or lower lie than the one previous to it. If the hosel design and manufacturing processes allow it, the lie of an iron can be bent 3-4 degrees . There are 10 different color codes which each of them . There are many bunkers that are less then 16.5 feet from the pin. Unit 43 IMEX Centre. Upright: A term used to describe a lie angle in which the toe of any metal wood, . If you are looking to reduce a fade/slice then choose the more upright setting, and the opposite to reduce the draw/ hook. The loft of a golf club is the angle that the clubface makes with the shaft. How does a 1-degree change in lie angle affect ball flight? The club will then be aiming left and the ball is more likely to go to the left. If you are between 5'3" and 6'2" then lie angle will be more of a consideration than club length. The fitter can then analyze a golfer's swing pattern and adjust the lie angle accordingly. The longer the club the FLATTER the lie angle is needed. Lines and emails are open and managed from 9:00am - 5:00pm . More loft means numerically higher--a 12-degree driver has more loft than a 9-degree. 9 comments Golfers who swing faster than 120mph would require a loft below 9.5 degrees and those golfers with a slower swing below 90mph would be better choosing a loft between 11.5 . It'll make a huge difference, my clubs are 1.5 degrees flatter than they should be and I certainly notice it A LOT. The change in shaft could have also led to a change in ball flight. Lie angle is the angle in which the shaft intersects the head relative to the ground. Effects of a Closed Clubface. Loft is the angle of the face of the club relative to the ground. Grey cord grip with one extra . The 10% are very consistent players and hence will be able to make out the change quite easily. The loft of your club is determined by the angle of the face in correlation to the center of the shaft. If 4 loft does not divide out in even increments, simply interpolate the distance. A lie angle that is too flat results in a shot that is off to the right of your target. The higher the loft of your club is, the higher will be the flight path of your golf ball. Seems like those longer clubs would exaggerate swing and ball flight issues when one is not playing the correct lie angle. This adjustment will add launch and help you fight the banana ball. Traveling around the globe from Washington, DC, you'd miss by . Lie Angle. I'm also 1.52 degrees flat. I have a 17-degree 4-wood, a 21-degree hybrid, a 26-degree hybrid, and a 29-degree iron as my longer (non-driver) clubs. Loft affects trajectory and spin rate so it determines the distance the ball will travel. Try this: If you tend to hold on to the club through impact and struggle with slices, close the face a bit. In Fitting: Driver lie angle is not a huge factor to worry about in fitting because: 1. Each set of irons is stamped with a dot color that signifies its lie angle and shaft length and while this . A closed golf driver face was thought to help control a slice. I know Sieckmann is an advocate of flattening the lie angle on wedges. It makes sense that a golf club with a lower loft - say, 23 degrees - will make the ball go farther than one with a higher loft (say, 36 degrees). It enables the sole of the club head to strike the ground flat if it is correct. A very closed club face of 1 degree or greater can . SKU: UCA9160P. But a closed face angle merely points your club left of target and doesn't solve the problem of hitting a slice. There is no standard too flat. The player on the left's spine has moved from 96.2 to 112.9, a difference of 16.7 degrees while the player on the right has only moved back a few degrees. The lie angle of a golfer's putter must be the angle that offers good eye position over the golf ball as well as good posture. How much does 1 degree of lie angle make difference? Now, to get that face square at impact, you need to open that 10 degree driver a couple degrees, thus adding loft. Obviously, with driver lies all around 58 degrees, the golf gurus have come to the conclusion that driver lie isn't too important. It has been found that around 90% of golfers cannot discern a change of 1-degree in the lie angle. I've tested a bunch of different drivers and found optimal performance with 12 degrees with one model, and as low as 9.5-10 degrees with another. If your swing speed is above 90mph then a 9.5 - 11 degree loft will give you the best angle of attack. Just be aware that outdoor lie angle readings will be approximately one-degree more upright because the lie board is slightly above your feet. After traveling from San Francisco to L.A., you'll be off by 6 miles. The exact lie angle varies from putter to putter. Does 1 or 2 degrees really make that much of a difference? First, quite simply, lie angle is the measured angle created by the sole of a golf club when flat against the ground and the angle of the shaft. Jm. Some players have lie angles that are as much as 2-3 degrees off, which means they are making things very difficult for themselves on approach shots! Long story short, there is no such thing as the right loft for all drivers. For example, if you add 1 inch, the club needs to be 1* flatter. . When you consider that you almost never execute a perfect swing, 1 degree off could easily cause you to be in the bunker instead of on the green. 64.5. 2. Lie Angle: n/a. a 5- wood (42 inches long) would have a lie angle of 58 . That's a smidge over 5/8ths of an inch. Lie angle too flat at impact. This is the angle between the shaft and ground at normal playing position. Agree..massive difference, it's so important. For example, if you add 1 inch, the club needs to be 1* flatter. This video I test how different iron lie angles can affect ball flight using GC2/HMT launch monitor to provide data.See how an online Golf Lesson with Michae. Intersect the two measurements to find your colour dot. . If the lie angles of your clubs are 1 degree greater than the manufacturer's standard, your clubs are 1 degree flat. The vertical bar you see resting against the face is measuring the loft and is touching the face at of the face height. Short irons and wedges are designed to have a considerable loft. One degree is starting to make a difference. How much of a difference does 5/8ths of an inch make? We . Just one degree of variance can have you missing your target by as much as 4 yards. Put some lie tape on the sole to test. LIE ANGLE. The driver loft that you choose can depend on your clubhead speed. You can actually adjust the loft angle by 1, 2, or 3 degrees. A lot of it depends on the center of gravity. Correct Loft for a Golf Driver. The reason I ask is that when I had my fitiing ( 1 degree upright ) the pro said that they only adjusted the lie angle up to the pitching wedge. (Image credit: Howard Boylan) If the sole does not come through to the ball flat to the ground but rather with the heel down more, this means that the club's lie angle is too upright for you. The first consequence to adopting a closed face is that the initial direction of the ball will be towards the left of the target line. The maximum lie angle allowed by the rules of golf is 80 degrees. The driver loft that you choose can depend on your clubhead speed. If you were trying to get from San Francisco to Washington, D.C., you'd end up on the other side of Baltimore, 42.6 miles away. Golf drivers from 2 years ago and before were manufactured with closed face angles from ranging from 0.5 - 2 degrees. Most 3-woods are about 43 inches long with a lie angle of about 57 up to 59 . Since such a precise hit is needed to take advantage of the lower loft, the "average" distance each club hits the ball tends to converge at lower lofts for less-skilled players. Some may need forgiving clubs, some just like feel and workability. The single axis swing DOES NOT need more upright lie angles in clubs. The player on the left's spine has moved from 96.2 to 112.9, a difference of 16.7 degrees while the player on the right has only moved back a few degrees. Monark Golf offers stepless putter shafts, single bend, double bend and triple bend putter shafts for putter heads with 72 degree and 90 degree lie angle as well as belly putter shafts. Launch Angle and Putter Fitting . Lie angle too upright at impact. - A 1 degree lie angle change, either flat or more upright, can cause a 4-yard difference either left or right of a straight target. If you are buying new equipment it's important to have your lie angles checked, if you have never had your lie angles checked, I really suggest you do. If you find your clubs need their lie angle changing, most PGA Professionals will be able to do this in a few minutes using a particular bending vice. If your measurements fall between two colours, then ball flight comes into play. Lie angles range from 3.75 degrees flat to 4.5 degrees upright in 0.75 degree increments. E.g. If your lie angles are lower by 1 degree, the clubs are 1 degree upright.. 64.5. Indeed, according to the new laws of ball flight, the angle of the club will impact the initial direction of the club the most. In our example, it would be the Blue dot (.75 degree upright) +1/2 inch in length. Shorter golfers often need a flatter lie angle, but again that is not a rule in stone. Lie Angle. You can check them by yourself with the . In a word, yes. An incorrect lie negatively impacts your golf club performance. In the example below: 19 difference between the 5 iron and PW = 19 4 = 4 with 3 degrees left . For every 1/2 inch you add to a club, the lie angle is effected by 1/2*. 4. Fairway Wood Loft Angle . For every degree that your lie angle is either too upright or flat, the ball will initially travel 4 yards off your intended target line. Without the proper lie angle you loose the ability to direct your ball accurately down the target line at the launch angle you prefer. Bilston Glen . Lie is the angle from the shaft to the ground when the golf club is placed in a normal playing stance position. Sixteen years ago, Golf Digest presented compelling evidence that average golfers needed to use drivers with more loft to maximize distancesometimes as much as 12, 14 or 16 degrees. I've tested a bunch of different drivers and found optimal performance with 12 degrees with one model, and as low as 9.5-10 degrees with another. Here is my driver set at 12.5 degrees of loft Lie angles form a crucial part of your equipment, with the wrong lie angles, you are really hindering your ability to hit good consistent shots. And the consensus is that a launch angle of three to four degrees is the ideal for putting (which explains why standard putter loft in off-the-shelf putters is 3-4 degrees). On average, our testers were 3 yards closer to their target with their best fit lie angle. If the lie angles of your clubs are 1 degree greater than the manufacturer's standard, your clubs are 1 degree flat. A player who is 5'6" with a wrist-to-floor measurement of 32" would fall in the red dot . Here is how a lie fitting procedure usually goes: Choose a club head that you like to play. . Most off-the-rack putters come standard at approximately 70 degrees. If you hit the ball 10 feet left of the pin, your lie angle would cause you to be an extra 6.5 feet left. How much does 1 degree of loft affect distance? If you use flat lie angle clubs and tend to slice the ball quite a bit, you may consider trying standard lie clubs. Now by my math, which is admitedly pretty darned shaky, I'm figuring that difference for a 6 iron being; For every 1.5 degree you bend the lie in either direction, you will affect the shot dispersion at .5 degrees..which would equate to about a .585" difference off-line at 150 yards. Changing lie angle by 4 on a club with only 8-10 of loft isn't going to make a hook, it might change horizontal launch by a fraction of a degree. . Flat Lie and Up Lie Sometimes, in the length fitting process, the lie angle is adjusted. We did the research to find out exactly how much impact a few degrees of lie can have. Industry standard lie angles have increased from 1 to 3 degrees across the board since the 1950s, possibly as a means to help . Lie angle matters because it impacts the direction that the clubface is pointing at the moment of impact. For more information or to speak to one of our PGA qualified customer services team call 0208 4016 901 or email info@golfbidder.co.uk. 2 Degree Difference in Lie Angle A lot of it depends on the center of gravity. . Titleist Vokey SM8 Lob Wedge / 60 Degree / Wedge Flex SM8 Vokey. . And, if you do manage to hit the ball accurately, you'll need to make some adjustments or compensations to make it happen. However, with others, it can lead to an enormous difference in their performance. Jm. . If your lie angles are lower by 1 degree, the clubs are 1 degree upright. Although most putters have lie angles between 70 and 72 degrees, there is no standard lie angle. Aug 25, 2015 at 6:39 pm . So, within reason, and for the average golfer, what difference does the lie angle of an iron (within a degree or two) really make when, in the course of play, one never has a perfectly flat lie as one has during the . $125.56 + $17.58 shipping + $17.58 shipping + $17.58 shipping. Lie boards are a good tool, but correcting the flight is most important. Loft in drivers ranges from 7 to 20 degrees, though most off-the-rack men's drivers have lofts between 8 and 11 degrees. Most other fairway woods increase the lie angle by 1 degree for every inch decrease in length i.e. Another effect of the clubface adjustment is that it . Lie Angle. If you play quite well, then maybe you may notice the change in the lie angle. Including me. Lie angle is the angle in which the shaft intersects the head relative to the ground.